The "Rude to the Server" Test and Other Yellow Flags

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Post by LadyIkaros on Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:02 am

caliseivy wrote:I haven't decided for certain whether this is a yellow flag, or a red flag; it seems to vary on my mood.
In the process of chatting me up (and asking me my relationship status) reminding me of my biological clock and how unsafe having kids after 3[X] years is.
The alert goes off in my head, but I can't really put to words what I could think it means about that person.

Red flag. RED flag!
It's presumptuous, overly intimate - certainly for someone you just casually met - condescending (I mean, really? He thinks you need him to explain to you how your biology works? Because women aren't bombarded with this message already), and suggests a controlling personality.

ED: And no, not normal, in my experience. The only guy I've come across who did something like this, was one a friend of mine broke up with. He harassed her for two years after the breakup.
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Post by nearly_takuan on Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:11 am

At the very least it suggests a certain amount of obliviousness and poor social calibration. People fumble their way around what they think is "small talk" all the time. People try to personalize their conversions with other people, whether to try to show cleverness or to get to know the other person better or just to be polite. But it's tricky to do that when you don't know very much about a person. The few details you can find that make the person you're speaking to different from everyone else are so superficial that anything "clever" you could possibly observe about them is almost guaranteed to just sound cliche to them. (ETA: see also people congratulating themselves for correctly guessing what "kind" of Asian you are, making "ironic" non-jokes about the fluency of your speech, name puns, vague guesses about occupation and status disguised as compliments, and anything else that ever had to be followed up with "I bet you get that all the time")

One will note that this charitable interpretation of the phenomenon also impress that the person thinking of the "biological clock" thing as different/personal enough to warrant special attention probably does not have many female acquaintances, which you may consider something of a yellow flag on its own.
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Post by fakely mctest on Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:18 am

caliseivy wrote:I haven't decided for certain whether this is a yellow flag, or a red flag; it seems to vary on my mood.
In the process of chatting me up (and asking me my relationship status) reminding me of my biological clock and how unsafe having kids after 3[X] years is.
The alert goes off in my head, but I can't really put to words what I could think it means about that person.

I think everyone else has covered how sketchy this move is (so sketchy), but here's something else to keep in your pocket the next time someone tries that on you: that is bad, stupid science.

The data on which that statistic is based is from 1700s France. They put together all these church birth records and then came up with these statistics about how likely it was [someone would] get pregnant after certain ages.

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Post by caliseivy on Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:12 pm

Wow thanks for the link. Even though I'm fairly sure I don't want children, this kind of makes me feel better.

I couldn't decide on red or yellow flag because I thought making it a red flag was on my part being difficult and not giving someone a chance when it could have just been a stupid mistake. I understand some of that belief is because women are taught to be nicer and understanding, but it's hard to determine whether you're being reasonable or being a hard-ass.
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Post by reboot on Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:54 pm

fakely mctest wrote:
caliseivy wrote:I haven't decided for certain whether this is a yellow flag, or a red flag; it seems to vary on my mood.
In the process of chatting me up (and asking me my relationship status) reminding me of my biological clock and how unsafe having kids after 3[X] years is.
The alert goes off in my head, but I can't really put to words what I could think it means about that person.

I think everyone else has covered how sketchy this move is (so sketchy), but here's something else to keep in your pocket the next time someone tries that on you: that is bad, stupid science.

The data on which that statistic is based is from 1700s France. They put together all these church birth records and then came up with these statistics about how likely it was [someone would] get pregnant after certain ages.

Not quite on topic, but I wonder why no one has thought to rerun that study using Danish or Swedish birth and health records? That way they could see outcomes ln the children that manifest after birth and rule out (for the most part) lack of prenatal care, malnutrition, etc.

But yeah, at minimum a yellow flag
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Post by Wondering on Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:26 pm

I say red flag. Anyone you just met making comments about your health or medical state which is not physically part of your presence at the time is way out of line. And you've had more than one person do this to you?

Making comments on a first meeting about your medical state that is physically part of your presence if you didn't bring it up strikes me as a yellow flag.

(Tangent: I find the British term "fell pregnant" (used in that article) disturbing. Like it was accidental, like you don't know how it happened, like it just happened and you didn't try? That says a lot to me about cultural mindset.)

(Other tangent: I got pregnant at 38 and it took us 13 months. So, over a year, but just barely. Plus, I have two additional, not-age-related medical conditions that likely were interfering. That 1700s study thing is BS.)

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Post by fakely mctest on Sat Mar 07, 2015 9:38 pm

Wondering wrote:(Tangent: I find the British term "fell pregnant" (used in that article) disturbing. Like it was accidental, like you don't know how it happened, like it just happened and you didn't try? That says a lot to me about cultural mindset.)

(Other tangent: I got pregnant at 38 and it took us 13 months. So, over a year, but just barely. Plus, I have two additional, not-age-related medical conditions that likely were interfering. That 1700s study thing is BS.)

I find "fell pregnant" extremely weird too! In fact, I had that very thought when I posted the link. I'd venture a guess that it's an older expression that continues into modern times.

A more modern study linked in the article finds that:

Nearly all pregnancies occurred within a 6 day fertile window. There was no evidence for a shorter fertile window in older men or women. On average, the day-specific probabilities of pregnancy declined with age for women from the late 20s onward, with probabilities of pregnancy twice as high for women aged 19–26 years compared with women aged 35–39 years. Controlling for age of the woman, fertility was significantly reduced for men aged >35 years. CONCLUSIONS: Women's fertility begins to decline in the late 20s with substantial decreases by the late 30s. Fertility for men is less affected by age, but shows significant decline by the late 30s.

But still, per the BBC article, "82% of women aged between 35 and 39 fell pregnant within a year."

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