Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

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Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Fri Apr 03, 2015 7:28 pm

Ok, I got to get this off my chest.....

This internalized envy and self-hatred is driving me insane, now I get jealous of other people over trivial things, If (for example) someone does a better job than me, I see him/her as a rival, If someone has more friends on Facebook, I unfriend them, If a couple walks by, I see another chance lost, I see a pretty guy/girl I like, I see them as something unattainable, when someone mentions love, I think of it as something for the beautiful people and therefore not for me, when someone asks "How old are you?" I hear "How many years wasted?"

Please make it stop... Crying

P.S. as usual, therapy is not helping, in fact progress has stagnated... I don't need self help exercises, I need HELP!!

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by reboot on Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:29 pm

Actually you do need the self-help exercises, maybe not the ones you have been given, but you need something to break you out of this pattern. Have you spoken to your therapist about feeling stalled? Also, it is not uncommon to get stuck on a specific issue for a while if it is something that is really hard to change or tied to other issues. Being stuck absolutely sucks, but some issues take a long, incremental, painful slog to deal with.

I totally feel for you. I have been there.
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:49 pm

reboot wrote:Actually you do need the self-help exercises, maybe not the ones you have been given, but you need something to break you out of this pattern. Have you spoken to your therapist about feeling stalled? Also, it is not uncommon to get stuck on a specific issue for a while if it is something that is really hard to change or tied to other issues. Being stuck absolutely sucks, but some issues take a long, incremental, painful slog to deal with.

I totally feel for you. I have been there.

1. Yes I have told my therapist, repeatedly, about feeling stagnated. but she insists on staying with her "plan", All I am asking is for a better plan.

2. I know it's a long painful slog to deal with, but I think it is counter productive to make it longer and more painful.

Also, I try to tell her how I feel but I feel like I am talking to a brick wall... Being ignored is one of my pet peeves, I really, really hate being ignored, it pisses me off. In fact I have hit the refresh button over 25 times since starting the thread to see if anyone responded, To be honest I felt that I was abandoned. (I know, Jerkbrain talking, still working on it. Facepalm )

I appreciate the help but for now, I need help to deal with this self-hatred for the time being, anything will do...

P.S. Please do not mention the Doc or link me to his advice, I still do not trust him or his advice. (Nothing personal against the Doc, its just that I am A person that expects results, especially now that I am desperate, as in "Great Britain during the Battle of Britain" desperate, now that I am 25 i.e. officially un-dateable.)

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by reboot on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:02 pm

Know what you need to do? Tell her exactly what you have said here. Even print it out and read it:

1. I feel like talking to you is like talking to a brick wall
2. I feel like you are ignoring my concerns and not listening to me
3. I want a better treatment plan. One where you explain more about what is being done and why.
4. If you do not think that you can do this, please refer me to a new therapist. I do not think we are a good thereputic fit

It took me 5-6 therapists to find one I liked and whose style matched well with my personality and needs. You might have to shop around. Hopefully, though, she will hear you and be able to change.
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:07 pm

reboot wrote:Know what you need to do? Tell her exactly what you have said here. Even print it out and read it:

1. I feel like talking to you is like talking to a brick wall
2. I feel like you are ignoring my concerns and not listening to me
3. I want a better treatment plan. One where you explain more about what is being done and why.
4. If you do not think that you can do this, please refer me to a new therapist. I do not think we are a good thereputic fit

It took me 5-6 therapists to find one I liked and whose style matched well with my personality and needs. You might have to shop around. Hopefully, though, she will hear you and be able to change.

This sounds astronomically expensive... pale

And again I ask, How do I deal with this internalized envy? I need help and advice for the time being, just a quick fix until my next (Monthly) session.
I need this: There, there Not this: Smash against wall (Talking to the wall, not smashing into it.)

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by reboot on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:17 pm

Alex1989 wrote:
reboot wrote:Know what you need to do? Tell her exactly what you have said here. Even print it out and read it:

1. I feel like talking to you is like talking to a brick wall
2. I feel like you are ignoring my concerns and not listening to me
3. I want a better treatment plan. One where you explain more about what is being done and why.
4. If you do not think that you can do this, please refer me to a new therapist. I do not think we are a good thereputic fit

It took me 5-6 therapists to find one I liked and whose style matched well with my personality and needs. You might have to shop around. Hopefully, though, she will hear you and be able to change.

This sounds astronomically expensive... pale

No. It is not like the next person charged more than the others. Since the therapy was not working for me, it made sense to stop paying for it with one person and start paying for someone with a different approach. I cannot even say it made the therapy longer, because even though I had at least 1-2 sessions with each new person, those were just replacing ones that would have been used with the other person doing something that was going nowhere.

Think of it as looking for a new barber. You do not try 5 at the same time. You try them one by one, each cut costing about the same as the previous, until you find one that you like. Just because you tried 5 different people does not make your haircuts more expensive Smile
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Enail on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:21 pm

In addition to what Reboot says, I think you might have better luck getting a 'better plan' if you can come up with some specifics of what you're unhappy with about the plan she's currently got, some other things you'd like to focus on instead of what she's having you focus on and so forth.  This stuff is going to take time, no matter what kind of therapy plan you've got, and I'm sure that will be frustrating even if she's very responsive, but that doesn't mean she shouldn't be paying attention to your concerns.

WRT dealing with envy and the like, I do want to remind you that no one here is an expert and all we can give you is non-expert ideas, so please take what we say with a grain of salt and only try suggestions if they don't conflict with your therapy exercises. Of course I want to help, and I'm sure others here do too, but I don't want you to be relying on us in ways that are beyond what we can actually do.   

One thing that might be worth a try:  I often find it helpful to use my imagination and observation to get me out of negative thought patterns. Like, if I feel like everyone's judging me, I'd try and come up with something else that each person might actually be focusing on. Do you think that might be something you could use to redirect your thoughts when they get onto harmful tracks? If you envy someone, try and come up with something really hard that could be going on in their life, if someone says something that makes you think you've wasted time, invent a reason they might be saying that due to an insecurity of their own. That kind of thing?
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:39 pm

Enail wrote:In addition to what Reboot says, I think you might have better luck getting a 'better plan' if you can come up with some specifics of what you're unhappy with about the plan she's currently got, some other things you'd like to focus on instead of what she's having you focus on and so forth.  This stuff is going to take time, no matter what kind of therapy plan you've got, and I'm sure that will be frustrating even if she's very responsive, but that doesn't mean she shouldn't be paying attention to your concerns.

WRT dealing with envy and the like, I do want to remind you that no one here is an expert and all we can give you is non-expert ideas, so please take what we say with a grain of salt and only try suggestions if they don't conflict with your therapy exercises. Of course I want to help, and I'm sure others here do too, but I don't want you to be relying on us in ways that are beyond what we can actually do.   

One thing that might be worth a try:  I often find it helpful to use my imagination and observation to get me out of negative thought patterns. Like, if I feel like everyone's judging me, I'd try and come up with something else that each person might actually be focusing on. Do you think that might be something you could use to redirect your thoughts when they get onto harmful tracks? If you envy someone, try and come up with something really hard that could be going on in their life, if someone says something that makes you think you've wasted time, invent a reason they might be saying that due to an insecurity of their own. That kind of thing?

first of all: THANK YOU!!!!!!!! cheers cheers cheers cheers this is the type of answer I was looking for!

I could try, but seeing that my (new) unit are way ahead of me in life, it will be extremely hard, to put this into perspective:

65% of them are married, in a relationship or have a FWB.
99% have a car (Guess who's the 1% who does not have one?)
75% are under the age of 30, all of them have lost their virginity BEFORE college
the majority are good looking, I am at best a 4/10
almost 3/4 of them are E-5,6 or 7 and have seen combat at least once.

Like I said I will try that, but I cannot guarantee it will work, again I am officially un-dateable(at least in PR...)

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by jcorozza on Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:35 pm

Has your therapist done any CBT/REBT stuff? It's all about changing the thought processes to healthier ones (and ones with less JerkBrain influence).

Something that I find helps me with this is, when I get jealous of a particular person, to think about bad things I know have happened to them. For example I have a friend who's my age (28), married to the only boyfriend she ever had, and has a job she loves and has had basically since college, and seems to often be busy with friends/etc. BUT. She's an only child, and her dad died while she was in college of a brain tumor. That's half of her immediate family that she doesn't have around anymore. So that's pretty crappy. Everyone has something crappy happen to them, and some people have a lot of crappy things happen to them. They just aren't always the same things.

Unfortunately, though, there's no quick fix for your issue. It will take time to change your thought process (although sometimes meds can help to speed this up, it's still not immediate).
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Sat Apr 04, 2015 12:13 am

jcorozza wrote:Has your therapist done any CBT/REBT stuff?  It's all about changing the thought processes to healthier ones (and ones with less JerkBrain influence).  

Something that I find helps me with this is, when I get jealous of a particular person, to think about bad things I know have happened to them.  For example I have a friend who's my age (28), married to the only boyfriend she ever had, and has a job she loves and has had basically since college, and seems to often be busy with friends/etc.  BUT.  She's an only child, and her dad died while she was in college of a brain tumor.  That's half of her immediate family that she doesn't have around anymore.  So that's pretty crappy.  Everyone has something crappy happen to them, and some people have a lot of crappy things happen to them.  They just aren't always the same things.  

Unfortunately, though, there's no quick fix for your issue.  It will take time to change your thought process (although sometimes meds can help to speed this up, it's still not immediate).

While waiting for an answer to this thread I thought I should have a mental DEFCON system, each level has a corresponding action to help keep head straight:

DEFCON 5: Normal mental state and alertness, situation normal.
DEFCON 4: Normal mental state, increased alertness, situation normal.
DEFCON 3: Increased stress, increased situational awareness, use stress relief and relaxation methods if necessary. (I am at this level now.)
DEFCON 2: Very stressed, mental state declining, emotionally depressed state, suicidal ideation possible, seek professional help.
DEFCON 1: Mental exhaustion, Major depressive episode, SUICIDAL ATTEMPT IMMINENT, HOSPITALIZE IMMEDIATELY!

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Enail on Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:20 am

That sounds like a really good idea, Alex!
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by reboot on Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:11 am

I like that idea too.

Also, I am going to move this thread to Health and Wellbeing, since the advice is trending that way
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Sun Apr 05, 2015 9:11 pm

Enail wrote:That sounds like a really good idea, Alex!

I know, I hope I can get past this roadblock during therapy...
I have a ton of issues to work on... I ashamed just by mentioning it.
Among them is desperately wanting to feel desired.
Sad

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Enail on Sun Apr 05, 2015 9:14 pm

I don't think there's anything shameful about having many issues to work on, or about wanting to be desired. I'd tend to look at it instead as courageous to work on them. That's not an easy thing to do!
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by jcorozza on Sun Apr 05, 2015 9:18 pm

Agree with Enail - even admitting that you have issues to work through is really hard, and takes a lot of guts. Getting help for them takes even more.
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by kleenestar on Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:56 pm

Alex, I also struggle with envy. The things that provoke it for me are different but it sounds like the feeling is very much the same. I hope it helps to know that other people have a hard time with this issue.

The way that I handle my feelings of envy is as follows:
1) First, I notice and name what I am feeling. "Wow, I am very envious of what this other person has. I am angry at myself for not having it. I am judging myself negatively for not having it."
2) Next, I say, "It is okay to feel this way, but I should not take it literally. My mind is telling me something useful - this is a thing I want - but it isn't doing so in a helpful way."
3) Finally, I use the idea of helpfulness to reframe. "A more helpful way to look at this is to say, here is a person who could teach me something about this thing I desperately want." The person may not be a good teacher, and I may not be wise enough to see what I can learn from them, but it's a better place to start than envy and self-hatred.

I hope this is helpful!
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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 06, 2015 11:22 am

kleenestar wrote:Alex, I also struggle with envy. The things that provoke it for me are different but it sounds like the feeling is very much the same. I hope it helps to know that other people have a hard time with this issue.

The way that I handle my feelings of envy is as follows:
1) First, I notice and name what I am feeling. "Wow, I am very envious of what this other person has. I am angry at myself for not having it. I am judging myself negatively for not having it."
2) Next, I say, "It is okay to feel this way, but I should not take it literally. My mind is telling me something useful - this is a thing I want - but it isn't doing so in a helpful way."
3) Finally, I use the idea of helpfulness to reframe. "A more helpful way to look at this is to say, here is a person who could teach me something about this thing I desperately want." The person may not be a good teacher, and I may not be wise enough to see what I can learn from them, but it's a better place to start than envy and self-hatred.

I hope this is helpful!

Why did I not think of it that way. Headsmack

Kleenestar, You are a genius. *purrs and wags tail* Razz

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Re: Ok, this is driving me up a wall.

Post by kleenestar on Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:33 pm

My pleasure to help! Let me know how trying this practice goes. It is hard work but it has worked for me - and it is such a relief to be able to be around people who have things I want without feeling awful. Plus, I've actually learned a lot of things from them by adopting this attitude. Smile
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