[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by The Wisp on Fri Jun 12, 2015 7:53 pm

Since social justice stuff has come up in the comments

Okay, so right of the bat, I will say that I'm going to mostly be talking at the meta level and I'm not very interested in discussing the object-level stuff beyond gesturing at it unless I specifically bring it up first.

You all probably know I'm not as fully invested into feminism or social justice or certain aspects of the left as most of the other members here (unless you define 'feminism' and 'social justice' in the broadest and vaguest of ways, e.g. "feminism means women are people too!"). Certainly I agree with aspects of feminism/social justice/the left (for convenience, I'll just abbreviate to FSJL), or at least things that are often packaged with adjacent to them.

For example, I'm on board with the idea of that there are sociological facts about the inequality between certain groups in my society. I'm also on board for taking other people's experiences and emotions seriously (though not necessarily their interpretations of them, or the political or philosophical ideology they think is necessarily packaged with it). Generally, being nice, being aware of negative stereotypes I may have absorbed and checking them so I don't treat people as The Other is something I am striving to be.

But then there's a lot of stuff that I have mixed feelings about, and a few things I actively think are wrong and actually make me angry. And these things I'm not so sure I'm as malleable as I was in the past on the "being nice to people" stuff.

I guess these thoughts and feelings have been festering for awhile, long before I even started posting here. I just don't know where to go to talk about them and process them. I don't want to throw my thoughts in the face of people who are apart of oppressed groups when I'm often unsure about them, and in any case even when I am sure I don't think the conversation would be productive. Nor do I want to got to places that just exist to provide vitriolic critiques of FSJL like MRAs or Tumblr in Action.

Even self-proclaimed 101 spaces aren't really what I'm talking about, as they are more for people who want to learn what FSJL is about, rather than places where there can be reasonable discussion where not all the points of view come completely within FSJL.

I guess what I'm asking is: how and where can I go to sort these things out? Maybe there aren't? Maybe it's too politically charged for that to be possible? Maybe only in academia or something?

Anybody have experiences with a situation like this even if not on these certain issues?

Because right now I'm in a place where I just never talk about it, which leads to just a dull frustration and a lack of working through these thoughts, ideas, and emotions and figuring out which are valid, which are not, what I should believe, without just bending backwards and accepting the FSJL frame in its entirety.

I also feel rather invested in this because I seem to share many of the same social and cultural values with people who also strongly believe in FSJL and get along best with these people (even my one real life friend is involved in lefty activism) so it's not like I can enjoy these issues.

Sorry if this is rambling, I hope what I'm getting at is clear.
The Wisp
The Wisp

Posts : 896
Reputation : 198
Join date : 2014-10-01

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by Caffeinated on Fri Jun 12, 2015 8:03 pm

I think it may not be possible to find a good place online to talk about this. The way the internet seems to work encourages people to congregate too tightly around their pre-existing opinions for there to be a place for mixed thoughts and feelings. Also the internet is forever. Personally, I think it's best to talk about this stuff in person with people you know in meatspace. Parents, siblings, friends, relatives, etc. In person there's more space for nuance and questioning.
Caffeinated
Caffeinated

Posts : 455
Reputation : 273
Join date : 2014-12-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by PintsizeBro on Fri Jun 12, 2015 9:33 pm

Unfortunately I think Caffeinated is probably right.

That being said, I do have some mixed feelings towards some aspects of FSJL myself, so if you're interested in telling me your thoughts, feel free to shoot me a PM.

PintsizeBro

Posts : 307
Reputation : 233
Join date : 2015-02-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by eselle28 on Fri Jun 12, 2015 10:09 pm

You know, one thing you might want to consider is setting up your own blog space where you try to puzzle out your thoughts and letting people in various communities know in a low key way what the address to it is. I think you'll have smaller discussions with fewer people, but sometimes even writing about things can help, and it gives you the ability both to distance those thoughts from people who might find them harmful and to moderate the comments to make sure you're not stuck in dialogue with anyone who you think might be harmful to you.
eselle28
eselle28
General Oversight Moderator

Posts : 1994
Reputation : 999
Join date : 2014-09-24

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by The Wisp on Sat Jun 13, 2015 12:37 am

I do think in person interactions would be better, I just don't have many opportunities to talk to real people about political topics.

pintsizedbro wrote:That being said, I do have some mixed feelings towards some aspects of FSJL myself, so if you're interested in telling me your thoughts, feel free to shoot me a PM.

Thanks for the offer, I'll keep it in mind if I need to talk about it Smile

eselle28 wrote:You know, one thing you might want to consider is setting up your own blog space where you try to puzzle out your thoughts and letting people in various communities know in a low key way what the address to it is. I think you'll have smaller discussions with fewer people, but sometimes even writing about things can help, and it gives you the ability both to distance those thoughts from people who might find them harmful and to moderate the comments to make sure you're not stuck in dialogue with anyone who you think might be harmful to you.

I've considered blogging on these subjects before, I just need to do it. Also, it's harder to turn vague thoughts and ideas into blogposts than one would think. Maybe I should try again, now that it's the summer and my classload is lessened. Last time I tried I never brought it up anywhere which felt weird, which meant nobody read it, which meant that I lost motivation really fast! Razz

Still, not a bad idea at all...
The Wisp
The Wisp

Posts : 896
Reputation : 198
Join date : 2014-10-01

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by BasedBuzzed on Sat Jun 13, 2015 6:07 am

From what I've seen, you're skeptical of some aspects of social justice when they seem counterproductive towards the seeming goals of social justice, along with a fear that this might actually make you take side with the oppressors...which is probably a concern many of the members here share. I mean, we have threads on that subject about once every two weeks.

If you look at the thread that would come closest to the perceived SJW stereotype(the misandrist bitchery one)...it's pretty much only aiming its arrows at the type of person that wouldn't even be defended on TiA.

_________________
Pompeii, VIII.2 (in the basilica); 1904: "O walls, you have held up so much tedious graffiti that I am amazed that you have not already collapsed in ruin."
BasedBuzzed
BasedBuzzed

Posts : 811
Reputation : 267
Join date : 2014-10-01

View user profile

Back to top Go down

[Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole Empty Re: [Adv/disc] How and where to process mixed thoughts and feelings about feminism/social justice/the left without being an asshole

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum