[Adv] Long walks on a beach: adventures in analysis paralysis

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[Adv] Long walks on a beach: adventures in analysis paralysis Empty [Adv] Long walks on a beach: adventures in analysis paralysis

Post by nearly_takuan on Mon Jun 15, 2015 12:27 am

Seems like this is the subforum to drop "social skills" stuff in, but it's not really a Meeting People thing so if this is the wrong spot after all, please feel free to move this thread. Also, I'm probably going to meander and get a little ranty sometimes, so...advance apologies. A lot of stuff just happened in a lot of ways on a lot of different life-vectors. Not going into all of 'em here, but what I'm trimming it down to is still kind of tangled....

Backstory.

Somewhat recently, I went on a trip to a beach with a few friends. One, whom I will randomly name Jill, is someone I've known for about five years. We are both somewhat socially awkward sorts.

Shortly after it got dark, she said she wanted me to go with her to the shoreline. So we...did that, and then she wanted us to stand in the water. She asked me to hold her hand first. She made it so when we did we were locking fingers and our shoulders were pressed together. Then we waded into the tides, just up to where the higher waves would briefly touch our knees.

I tried to stand there with her but I got too cold. No blood-alcohol. We made our way back to the campfire. She didn't let go of my hand until we sat down again. And about half an hour later, she asked if we could go back and do the same thing. So we did. The same exact thing.

Punchlines.

Jill was drunk and high pretty much all night. She had almost no balance, and the riptides and the sucking sand didn't exactly make that easier. Given the way she was staggering, it's entirely possible she needed a hand to hold just so she wouldn't fall down. Later she went back there with others (I had to stay behind to tend the fire) and she did fall down. I guess that could be taken to mean she wasn't holding anyone's hand. However, Roommate (who doesn't necessarily know her better than I, but who is much more cuddly and has cuddled/spooned with her and most of the other women we've ever been mutually acquainted with) says the hand-holding is just part of what Jill is like when she is drunk. I don't trust myself to read that kind of stuff accurately. Especially because that was Drunk Jill and I do not know how that relates to what Sober Jill wants.

I tried to ask her about life stuff, to talk about how she's going to be moving more permanently to near where I live, but I ended up asking stupid too-complicated-for-drunk-conversation things. Killed the conversation with embarrassment. Probably not important in the Grand Scheme, but there it is.

I did not have any other-than-friendship feelings about Jill before that night. When we met, she had a boyfriend. Their breakup was a while ago now, but it did not go smoothly. She's over it, he's not, and because of the potential for complication (and a couple of other unrelated factors) I've held the switch firmly in the "off" position. And so, after various different types of conversations we've had, the proverbial ball is definitely in my court. For all I know I already fucked it up.

Consequences.

If I ask her out and she says no, I'm not going to be devastated. The problem, believe it or not, is if she doesn't say no. Because I don't know if she'll believe that's true, after everything.

I think she can sometimes be a little too considerate and agreeable. She may agree to something she doesn't really want just to humor me. I don't know where it would stop.

I don't want to let her down, be unfair to her, etc. She's already done that dance once.

But whether deliberately or by chance, she seems to have toggled the "switch". It's never really been on before.

I don't know what to do. But I guess that would've been obvious.
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Post by Guest on Mon Jun 15, 2015 9:13 am

Ask her out.

Trust her to know what she wants and act accordingly.

If you're worried that she'll "go along to get along," watch for signs of it. If she looks reluctant, back down. Become a poster child for enthusiastic consent. If she seems lukewarm or unsure, give her some soft no outs -- ask her if she needs to check her calendar before giving you a date and time, etc.

Good luck!

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Post by gaboz on Mon Jun 15, 2015 9:17 am

Nearly_takuan wrote:Backstory.

Somewhat recently, I went on a trip to a beach with a few friends. One, whom I will randomly name Jill, is someone I've known for about five years. We are both somewhat socially awkward sorts.

Shortly after it got dark, she said she wanted me to go with her to the shoreline. So we...did that, and then she wanted us to stand in the water. She asked me to hold her hand first. She made it so when we did we were locking fingers and our shoulders were pressed together. Then we waded into the tides, just up to where the higher waves would briefly touch our knees.

I tried to stand there with her but I got too cold. No blood-alcohol. We made our way back to the campfire. She didn't let go of my hand until we sat down again. And about half an hour later, she asked if we could go back and do the same thing. So we did. The same exact thing.

sounds like a fun random experience.

Nearly_takuan wrote:Punchlines.

Jill was drunk and high pretty much all night. She had almost no balance, and the riptides and the sucking sand didn't exactly make that easier. Given the way she was staggering, it's entirely possible she needed a hand to hold just so she wouldn't fall down. Later she went back there with others (I had to stay behind to tend the fire) and she did fall down. I guess that could be taken to mean she wasn't holding anyone's hand. However, Roommate (who doesn't necessarily know her better than I, but who is much more cuddly and has cuddled/spooned with her and most of the other women we've ever been mutually acquainted with) says the hand-holding is just part of what Jill is like when she is drunk. I don't trust myself to read that kind of stuff accurately. Especially because that was Drunk Jill and I do not know how that relates to what Sober Jill wants.

I tried to ask her about life stuff, to talk about how she's going to be moving more permanently to near where I live, but I ended up asking stupid too-complicated-for-drunk-conversation things. Killed the conversation with embarrassment. Probably not important in the Grand Scheme, but there it is.

I did not have any other-than-friendship feelings about Jill before that night. When we met, she had a boyfriend. Their breakup was a while ago now, but it did not go smoothly. She's over it, he's not, and because of the potential for complication (and a couple of other unrelated factors) I've held the switch firmly in the "off" position. And so, after various different types of conversations we've had, the proverbial ball is definitely in my court. For all I know I already fucked it up.

Hummm, roomie knows her at least a bit better then you. And while i believe that drunk people do release their restraint and are more willing to tell the truth, i think she is just more a pleasant drunk type of girl. but you are overthinking the rest. It was was fun whit the water thing. she went of tripped and returned to you for the waterthingie again. So at least she trusts you.

Nearly_takuan wrote:Consequences.

If I ask her out and she says no, I'm not going to be devastated. The problem, believe it or not, is if she doesn't say no. Because I don't know if she'll believe that's true, after everything.

I think she can sometimes be a little too considerate and agreeable. She may agree to something she doesn't really want just to humor me. I don't know where it would stop.

I don't want to let her down, be unfair to her, etc. She's already done that dance once.

But whether deliberately or by chance, she seems to have toggled the "switch". It's never really been on before.

I don't know what to do. But I guess that would've been obvious.

Man what can i say. I use this as a base; yes = maybe, maybe = no, no = not worth my time.
Go for it.

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Post by Caffeinated on Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:53 am

nearly_takuan wrote:But whether deliberately or by chance, she seems to have toggled the "switch". It's never really been on before.

Definitely ask her out. If you're a person who's switch is very seldom toggled to on, and you meet someone who does toggle it, and she's available and appears to have positive feelings toward you as well, of course you ask her out.

As for the worry about her being maybe too agreeable, that's something to let her be in charge of, because adults have to be in charge of their own actions.
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Post by reboot on Mon Jun 15, 2015 12:01 pm

Caffeinated wrote:
nearly_takuan wrote:But whether deliberately or by chance, she seems to have toggled the "switch". It's never really been on before.

Definitely ask her out. If you're a person who's switch is very seldom toggled to on, and you meet someone who does toggle it, and she's available and appears to have positive feelings toward you as well, of course you ask her out.

As for the worry about her being maybe too agreeable, that's something to let her be in charge of, because adults have to be in charge of their own actions.

I agree with Caffeinated. Ask her out and trust her as an fully functioning adult to manage her own feelings/actions.
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Post by nearly_takuan on Mon Jun 15, 2015 12:09 pm

Jeez, forgot to also say, I've been pretty low otherwise. I dunno, guess I'm just not trusting any of my own thoughts right now. Sorry for coming here asking stupid questions with incomplete data.

Seems pretty clear what's to be done, though. Might take a while but I'll work up the nerve somehow.
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Post by nearly_takuan on Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:13 pm

Aaand never mind. There's that question answered, and complications eliminated. Thanks for input, anyway.
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