Re: Do men have a problem with empathy?

[Guest]

I'd say yes we do

I have a problem taking seriosly women who say they have just as hard a time in dating as men. The moment any woman asserts this it is difficult to quiet the cynic in my mind:
"oh I feel bad for you- too bad your super-handsome/rich/popular boy doesn't appreciate you're mediocre ass"
"or you should try more average men you stuck up princess I'm sorry that fat and/or bald men disgust you, you stuck up hypocrite"
"or I'm sorry your other numberous relationships turned out bad and you have to face the prospect of being single for a whole week!! quelle horreur!"

While I too have the capacity to feel this way, surely you're referring to a very specific kind woman instead of 'all women, everywhere'.....right?

[nolorn]

While I too have the capacity to feel this way, surely you're referring to a very specific kind woman instead of 'all women, everywhere'.....right?

To be honest I don't know

it is better if I know the girl more, instead of reading her post on an online form or hearing her just talking online

I don't know what to do about it.

[Guest]

I don't know what to do about it.

There are women on this forum (and on the main site) who talk about their difficulties with dating/sex/relationships because they don't fit into the narrow cultural beauty norms in society. Maybe you could make a conscious effort to pay attention to and ruminate on their stories in the future?

[nolorn]

I don't know what to do about it.

There are women on this forum (and on the main site) who talk about their difficulties with dating/sex/relationships because they don't fit into the narrow cultural beauty norms in society. Maybe you could make a conscious effort to pay attention to and ruminate on their stories in the future?

Hard to do that when they have had multiple partners and I am still a virgin- I know it is tough but it is to me like a rich man complaining about how to spend his money when I'm homeless

I guess it's just a mantra/self flagellation that has to do for me.

[Guest]

Hard to do that when they have had multiple partners and I am still a virgin- I know it is tough but it is to me like a rich man complaining about how to spend his money when I'm homeless

I guess it's just a mantra/self flagellation that has to do for me.

Nolorn, I'm a virgin too. The way you feel? It doesn't have to be that way.

Also, we're derailing. Maybe we can talk about this in a separate thread?

[Conreezy]

This is going to be difficult to put, but here goes:

I struggle internally with avoiding the classically manly approach of downplaying my wife's emotions.  I don't want to be the guy who just waves everything away as nothing, but I am the type of person who doesn't freak out over much.  5 years as a paramedic put a lot into perspective (and burned some compassion out, I'll admit).  My wife is the opposite of me in a lot of ways--she doesn't deal with stress well and has clinically diagnosed depression and anxiety issues, which can turn lots of molehills into mountains.  I can come off as callous because I'll ignore or underplay something that she thinks is a huge deal.  After a few years of this, I've tried really hard to put myself in her shoes, but it can be exhausting having to sort the "real" issues from the BS, especially when so much of it can be personally damaging.  I don't like to think of it that way, but there's not enough patience in me to respond to everything she brings up. I'm sure everyone has only so much emotional space to give to someone else, and there's where I find my trouble: when can I stop being empathetic without becoming "that guy?"  My view is that if someone is offering their empathy, I shouldn't overstay the welcome.  How much of her own emotional work can I expect her to handle alone?

Walking the line between being empathetic (and learning from the times when I'm not) and not being steamrolled is a tough act to pull off for me.  

I think your situation specifically could well be a thread of its own, if you want to discuss it (and my relationship has some similarities, so I'd probably have some thoughts there) so I'm just going to keep it to the thread topic here. It sounds like you feel like empathy and getting to have boundaries are in direct opposition.  And, I think often they are presented that way in society at large, and it is a tricky balance for anyone to navigate...but for some reason, this isn't something I recall ever hearing women express, only men. Not sure what to make of that, just interesting.

I'm fine with discussing it. God knows I could use some help with it at the moment.

[Enail]

I'm fine with discussing it. God knows I could use some help with it at the moment.

Then, by all means, start a thread!

[kleenestar]

I just want to say that I think it's pretty freaking awesome that several of the guys in this thread have been so clear, insightful, and courageous about their struggles with empathy, even when (particularly when!) it's maybe not such a pretty picture. I know I've been putting on my research hat a bunch recently but I wanted to let you know that I'm delighted to listen and I'm learning a lot.

[Gamerz]

As another guy, I'll put my two cents in.

Growing up, I had a dad who showed very little in the way of emotion, and a mom who showed a lot of empathy towards *everyone*. So I ended up being the kind of guy who can empathize greatly with other people, but can often seem distant in his empathy (if that makes sense?).

It's great when it comes to work, because, being a supervisor at work, I'm really good at resolving conflicts by showing each side the other's perspective without people thinking that I'm 'taking sides'.

However, it's tougher when it comes to relationships. I let things slide too much. I have a hard time expressing how I feel when something between my partner and I is bothering me. So I empathize with my partner and just come up with these reasons why they could be acting or doing something that is bothering me so I don't have to deal with it. This leads up to this bottling up of feelings that ends up just making me ultimately resenting them until it comes out in a rant-filled diatribe that ends up hurting us both.

[Xexyz]

And, I think often they are presented that way in society at large, and it is a tricky balance for anyone to navigate...but for some reason, this isn't something I recall ever hearing women express, only men. Not sure what to make of that, just interesting.

Interesting, because I hear women very commonly express this sentiment. Most of the time it's expressed as themes of doing all the emotional work in the relationship. Or were you referring to something different?

[Enail]

And, I think often they are presented that way in society at large, and it is a tricky balance for anyone to navigate...but for some reason, this isn't something I recall ever hearing women express, only men. Not sure what to make of that, just interesting.

Interesting, because I hear women very commonly express this sentiment.  Most of the time it's expressed as themes of doing all the emotional work in the relationship.  Or were you referring to something different?

I've heard women express that they feel they're expected to do the emotional work in the relationship, or that they land up doing it because they have/are perceived to have the most skill at empathy in the relationship, but I feel like there's a bit of difference there. The phrasing (as I've heard it, I have no idea if this is remotely a common difference by gender or if it's just a fluke) is more about dynamics within a relationship (or society), rather than about an inherent tug-of-war between empathy and boundaries within an individual.

(I'm rather just thinking out loud here, so it may be that not only is this gender difference I've perceived not actually something that exists, but that the nuance I'm trying to pick out makes no difference and/or sense.)

[Xexyz]

And, I think often they are presented that way in society at large, and it is a tricky balance for anyone to navigate...but for some reason, this isn't something I recall ever hearing women express, only men. Not sure what to make of that, just interesting.

Interesting, because I hear women very commonly express this sentiment.  Most of the time it's expressed as themes of doing all the emotional work in the relationship.  Or were you referring to something different?

I've heard women express that they feel they're expected to do the emotional work in the relationship, or that they land up doing it because they have/are perceived to have the most skill at empathy in the relationship, but I feel like there's a bit of difference there. The phrasing (as I've heard it, I have no idea if this is remotely a common difference by gender or if it's just a fluke) is more about dynamics within a relationship (or society), rather than about an inherent tug-of-war between empathy and boundaries within an individual.

(I'm rather just thinking out loud here, so it may be that not only is this gender difference I've perceived not actually something that exists, but that the nuance I'm trying to pick out makes no difference and/or sense.)

Yeah, when you put it that way I can see where there's a difference.

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